Oh, and Welcome to Pixies thanatos80!

I'm just so happy my 16 year old is modest about what she wears. I'm lucky I haven't had a big quarrel about the clothes she wears. Oh yeah we had a run in over thongs but that was more of a Dad's roaring. (which she ignored) I think kids should be kids for as long as they can. If they could only see it from our vantagepoint I don't think they'd be in such a hurry to grow up. TO each his own, that's just my nickel's worth.

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As to marriage or celibacy, let a man take which course he will. He will be sure to repent - Socrates

Love is not looking in each other's eyes, but looking together in the same direction - Antoine De Saint-Exupery

Well, I have never dressed in the manner you describe. It's not comfortable, it's not appealing, and it's just not classy at all. Most young girls just want to look like the people they see on the idiot box; it's what is marketed to them as "sexy", even though it really just looks cheap.

I hope that when/if I have kids we don't have this problem either. If we do, I guess "no excessive cleavage, no ass crack, no thong showing" will be my guidelines. Maybe by the time I decide to have a child this stuff will be out of fashion anyway.
*Crosses fingers*

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It's a BOY!!

Having just spent a couple months at a middle school I really was interested by the difference between how the girls were treated based on their style of dress. While the more provacatively dressed girls garnered the most attention (primarily from the opposite sex), often it was in a negative, teasing, taunting, even physical form. The goth type girls seemed to almost garner an equal amount of attention however it seemed to be more gentle in nature, less teasing, more talking. I think it would be good to do a sociological study of the quantity/quality of interactions middle school girls participate in based on their clothing style choices.

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The practice of putting women on pedestals began to die out when it was discovered that they could give orders better from there.~ Betty Grable

If I wanted your opinion, I'd remove the duct tape and ask you for it.~ Me
<~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~>
One man's dream is another man's nightmare~~~~> §¤ Lilith ¤§
~>My Scribbles<~
==>Gone Shopping<== ~Just a Quickie~ *~A Celebration Vacation~* ~Surprises~ Sleeping With the Window Open
What Did You Do Today? Self Defense Class ~Short Sweet Snippets~ § Summer Spin § Story Challenge Submission Pajamas

I work with a mom of a teenage daughter. The daughter moved from private to public school this year as she's now a freshman. The mom was quite dreadful of losing the school uniform. As she put it to me, she doesn't have much choice but for her to wear some revealing clothing as there isn't much else on the racks in the stores. Now of course her daughter is precisely a size zero which can make some of the choices limiting anyway. Even while attending the private school, on a school trip they were allowed to dress out of uniform but still had guidelines to meet, her daughter could not wear shorts because they couldn't find any in the stores that met the guideline of nothing shorther than her fingertips.

I think my parents were lucky ... the tomboy look was more my thing (I think it was more popular too) - jeans and a tshirt or sweatshirt and I was happy as a lark.

I'm reading over this thread (somewhat...I'll go back after I post this, so as not to be swayed one way or another), and pardon me all you momma's out there...but I can't help but think of myself and my girlfriends when we were 12-16ish or so.

I wore belly shirts (we just bought smaller shirts or shrunk our sweaters cause they didn't have a line of them back then) and hip huggers and mini skirts and went braless etc. etc. and my mom didn't really have a problem with it all. But...I knew girls who's parents would ban clothing of this sort and so they would have their friends (me and a few other girls) hold some clothing for them to change into when they got out of the house in "acceptable" garb. They'd change back before going home...sometimes forgetting something and getting grounded for sneaking around looking like a slut (or whatever the parent thought she looked like).

Seems to me, I remember these were the girls who got in the most "trouble" as far as running away...doing bad in school...fighting...sassing their parents...disrepecting their parents...resenting their parents...etc. etc. I mean...these girls were exactly what the parents were trying to get them NOT to be!


I will admit (and most of you already know) I did get pregnant at 14 and carried the baby to term and gave him up for adoption. But, I don't attribute that to my wardrobe expression!!!! I attribute that to my lack of sex education as far as when a girl can and can't get pregnant...and the fear of asking for birth control pills (assuming I needed parental consent) or going into a drug store and asking the person behind the counter for condoms (they never put them in the isles in my day). And I attribute my pregnancy to LOVE. Regardless if anyone believes one can love at such a tender age...I am here to tell you I was IN LOVE and I knew that having sex was the expression of that love that I wanted to do at that time. It was a pure and true accident of uneducation...one I never repeated...that I got pregnant. Matter of fact...there was a boom of unwanted pregnancies in my day...no matter the clothing style...and there still is a boom of unwanted/accidental pregnancies to this day! I think it's due to lack of education and fear of what someone would think if they knew they had an interest in sex. If a parent is clear and educates a young girl on sex...it sticks with them. I had friends in my time who's parents were so open and gave them all the knowledge they needed...and therefore the kids respected the parents teachings and took that knowledge out into the world with them daily.

OK...so they still might have dressed "in fashion". Who hasn't ever been under some form of peer pressure? But...with knowledge on their side, they never got pregnant or disrespected or resented their parents in the long run.

I loved and respected my mother despite the fact that she hadn't loaded me up on sexual knowledge! It never occured to her...or me...that my clothing had anything to do with the unexpected pregnancy. She knew my heart and knew her values were instilled in me and that I was my own person and not some tagged whore of the neighborhood! She knew that accidents happen and that she was partly to blame for not talking to me and giving me the education I needed at my age.

Now...here I go assuming again (cause, as I said, I haven't read the whole thread of replies)...

Is the connotation of this clothing biz...that a girl will be considered a bit of a whore and could/probably will be taken advantage of if she shows some skin? It's a double edged sword here, if that is the gist. Try and remember that most defense attorney's try to argue that point when trying to get their rapist clients off!

If I've missed the point completely...calm down! I'm going back to read it all NOW!

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Minds are like parachutes. They only work when they are open.

~Thomas Dewar~

I'm just asking questions here....What's the limit? What's over the limit? Is there a limit? (And yes, i do realize that each parent sets these)

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~~lost in you~~

And of all the comments so far, I find this to be the most interesting. It would seem that your observations imply that how they are dressed dictates how they are treated. One wonders if that holds true for adults as well as children.

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~~lost in you~~

I've read it all now...and I don't think I was too far off base!?

I've some other thoughts now though...in reading some of the brilliant responses from some of our most prolific members!

I've a feeling that the feel of this issue from a parents point of view is...You can't make the pervs stop looking and lusting, so don't let the girls put it on and they won't be noticed. Is this about right?

If so...

I'm in total agreement with what Loulabelle said...about sexy is sexy no matter if it's in a skin baring outfit or a potato sack! There will always be perverted people and we can't change that no matter how hard we try! Ever hear the expression, "undressing them with my eyes"? It's a matter of who we encounter...not what we are wearing.

OK...so you say...but why add to the perversion by revealing more?

To that I say...Style is style. I wore the midriffs and hip huggers to "fit in". I didn't do it to make the pervs come out of the woodwork. If they reared their ugly head, it wasn't my fault as I was trying to be a teen who fit in and didn't get teased and treated badly for not knowing how to be cool. Being a teen is really a tough time in our lives...TRY AND REMEMBER THAT folks of all parentage (those who have and those who will someday have).

I've gotta tell you all this...

Back in my day (oh gawd..I hate that expression), I didn't have the monetary advantage that most of my friends were afforded though allowances and clothing money, etc....so I had to work for what money I did get for my wardrobe. I'd take certain outfits and mix and match so that most people wouldn't notice that I had worn "that" ever before. Ya had to be kinda tricky to pull this off...but I got really good at it...aquiring a top here and a belt there and some shoes another time. It was the hardest part of my youth in trying to fool my peers into thinking I had new and cool clothing each and every time they saw me. Only my very closest friends knew my insider secret. At times, a close friend would give me something her parents had given her money for...a pair of clogs of hers, that I loved sticks, in my mind. My best friend, Ruth, knew how much I loved them and I could never afford anything like them and so she'd let me wear them occasionally and then one day she said. "I'll tell mom I left them on the bus or something...just don't wear them over here and they are yours"! She knew I wouldn't think of this as charity because she knew almost EVERYTHING about me and my life and still she was my best friend.

Why do I tell you all of this? To remind you all of just how hard it is to be a teenager!

I mean...who was the first teen to think of dying his/her hair purple? Why'd they do it? To "revolt" against authority (parents and otherwise) and stake a claim to fame in his own generation! Does that very person still have purple hair to this day? I think not (but can't be positive...lol!). Who was the first teen to go goth? What in the motherfuckinhell was she/he thinking? I want to be different. I'm not going to research "differences through the generations/ages"...I like it and I am doing it!

Now...we all know...in our maturity and infinite wisdom...that most "styles" are repeats of age old "been there, done that"...and that if everyone does it, it doesn't make YOU an individual. But these are teens we are talking about! Impressionable, immature, go with the flow teens! REMEMBER that time? I sure do (pining for those days!!!...lol again)!

I'll admit it...I DO always try and play "the devil's advocate" role. And yes...I am not a parent. But, I am damn sure if I was...the last thing I would want to do with my child is to alienate her...or him for that matter...with clothing issues that connotate that sex is bad and to keep your mind off of it till I say it is ok to think of it!

Instead, I would look um over before they left the house...tell them WOW, you look great...I might go buy something like that tomorrow...and give them their curfew...kiss their face off...and tell them to be so careful and think before they do anything...and then kiss um again and let them go...to think about me in that same outfit!!!

^^^^^^^^^^Gotcha!

Just seeing the forrest fore the trees folks!

Love ya!

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Minds are like parachutes. They only work when they are open.

~Thomas Dewar~

i believe it does. my father always told me...when you are wanting to make an impression, it does not matter how you perceive yourself but how others perceive you to be. it's not always justified or fair but there it is.

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Trees give peace to the souls of men * Nora Waln

The forest would be very quiet if no other birds sang than those who sing the best * Henry van Dyke

some fairly sordid tales, rambles, and anecdotes
Hypothetically Speaking * Something More * Cammy Interrupted * An Experimental Vacation * Masked * so..damn..hot * Thank You * My toy, his idea * no.19 Maple Lane * I Have A Surprise For You * Yesterday * In a Quiet Kitchen * help me decide * untitled prose * more untitled prose

But ladies ^^^^...we are talking about teens here!

I know, from experience, that we've only one chance to make a good first impression. But...um...do teens really think of that? I think everytime they leave the house they feel they are making an impression...first, middle and last...till next time when, something else comes along that they like better!

If our current day resume's had to include pics from our past...most of us here would be in the welfare line!!!! LOL!

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Minds are like parachutes. They only work when they are open.

~Thomas Dewar~

I understand what it is like to be a teenager, and I also understand what it is like to experience peer pressure. However, I also understand that there are certain aspects of life that many teens just aren't prepared emotionally and mentally to handle no matter what is perceived by others saying that teens of today are so much more mature then we were yesterday.

I do not allow my daughter to dress a certain way because she will be perceived as a certain type of person by others (no matter if she is NOT). We, as adults, understand that no matter how we believe that people should accept us as we are, that just doesn't happen most of the time. I do this because I KNOW that she isn't at a level of maturity to handle the comments and/or behaviors that a certain type of dress will cause in others. She isn't emotionally ready to understand why men/boys (and some women) would stare at her and make comments. She isn't emotionally ready to understand why certain women would call her a slut and stick their noses up in the air as she walked by. She isn't grounded enough in her "self" to be able to handle the reactions that would come her way.

My daughter and I talk. I prepare her the best I can for the world. I believe that if she has the correct information (without glossing it over), she will be better prepared to face what she will come across in her life.

This isn't JUST about dressing a certain way, or behaving a certain way, this is learning about life and having the ability to HANDLE what is thrown at you.

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A blessed thing it is for any man or woman to have a friend, one human soul whom we can trust utterly, who knows the best and worst of us, and who loves us in spite of all our faults.

No but if how they dress influences how they are treated by their peers or others then it's my job as a parent to make sure they are not mis-treated. While I can't control the actions of others I can control some of the variables that may lead to mis-treatment. Just like I would not permit my child to go somewhere unsafe alone where they could be harmed, I would not permit them to dress in a fashion that may warrant attention that they are not ready or mature enough to handle.

It's moot for me....I have boys. But let me say this, they will never leave the house with their pants around their thighs and their boxers hanging out.

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The practice of putting women on pedestals began to die out when it was discovered that they could give orders better from there.~ Betty Grable

If I wanted your opinion, I'd remove the duct tape and ask you for it.~ Me
<~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~>
One man's dream is another man's nightmare~~~~> §¤ Lilith ¤§
~>My Scribbles<~
==>Gone Shopping<== ~Just a Quickie~ *~A Celebration Vacation~* ~Surprises~ Sleeping With the Window Open
What Did You Do Today? Self Defense Class ~Short Sweet Snippets~ § Summer Spin § Story Challenge Submission Pajamas

Well if teenage girls look sexy no matter what they are wearing then covering up some of their bits and pieces isn't going to deflect from their desired effect.

Chey I agree with everything you have said. Your rules were my rules for my daughter and she lived through it all....

Chey? I never said teens of today are so much more mature than we were! I don't believe that in the least...to the oppisite...I think they have more to learn at 14 than I ever did. It seems the more children get today...the less mature they have to be...and therefore less responsible for their own actions...than I ever experienced!

I value good parents and their care and loving of a child coming up in this world today! I never said parenting was easy...matter of fact, I've always thought I am in awe of a parent that can get their child past the "peer years"...the years of going with the flow and following the herd.

That's the part that's tougher today than ever! Seems to me kids have been misgiuded by laws meant for abused children, and when in need, in their selfish eyes, want to "use" those laws against a parent who is trying to guide the child...not abuse him/her! Example: "If you ground me for violating curfew, I will call the "authorities" and tell them I am being abused"! It seems like a Twilight Zone episode I just saw lately...the one where the child has control over a whole family who believes that his every whim should be attended to or he will make something bad happen to them. His powers of persuasion keep the adults in line. That's what the up and coming kids of today seem to me! Turns out...in the end...he really just wanted someone to guide him with a stronger hand than his "magical" powers. The power of love and caring!

To be honest...I am scared of some them! And...I think they like it like that too!

I had the deepest respect for my elders when I was young. I don't see it in every child today. I see anger and saddness and fear and pain and a cry for attention...but especially anger...and I can't explain where this is coming from! How have things changed so drastically that the kids of today feel a need to take a gun to school and shoot everyone in sight? If I heard of one incident of it's kind in my youth...I can't remember it!!!! It scares the hell out of me!

I have great friends who's children are required to call me and Mr. Lixy...Mr. "Lixy" and Mrs. "Lixy" (real names obscured) and they are to say excuse me and please and thank you and may I and all the other reasonable polite manners taught to me when I was a child. I was a little uncomfortable with this new revelation for the kids...since the eldest son always knew us by our first or nicknames (called me by my first name...hubby by his nickname that his dad called him by), but our friend was a bit of a rebel in his time and didn't want his children to follow in his footsteps.

So...I guess it boils down to parenting and maybe I am learning something here too. Clothes make the child...as well as the man/woman????

I dunno....I still say if you dress all wrong in the eyes of your peers...and it's not your decision, but that of your parents...you might just get shunned or beat up or something or other! Kids can be so cruel...and if clothing can make a difference..I say Viva La Difference! (<----shitty french, if I do say so myself). I think we all grow out of the intolerable clothing stage! I'm no worse for the wear...<---pardon the pun!

And seriously...for all you parents who are hell bent on making them change their attitude of dress...just tell them you love it and you are going to wear the same style too! That'll put the fear of YIKES into um! If just telling them doesn't work...go and buy a top and/or jeans and don your thongs and make them go out in public with you. Worse case scenario? The neighbors will fence their yard with a cyclone fence! Ahhhhhh...more privacy for you!

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Minds are like parachutes. They only work when they are open.

~Thomas Dewar~