This one needs a needle too
 

Foley's IM

I was going to just post a straight link to the IM but this way you can choose whether you are ready to read it.

i'm not too sure what i think to this really.

Did you read the IM?

Here's more on Foley http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_Foley

:eew: :curse: makes me wanna :nuts: him.

asswipe

.................................................. .....................:wish: :cuffs:


:nod:

Another of the free world's knights in shining armour found to have feet of rust, or was that lust?

"Worship at the Altar of Youth" is a pretty name for an ugly thing.

absolutely no excuse. This is someone who is supposed to be making laws that protect minors from people like him.

I really just didn't have a comment about such a piece of slime. I didn't need to read the transcripts to know another privileged stupid predator was caught in the coconut bushes. The only thing that troubles me as much as knowing these criminals permeate our system and society is the statements of the people that want to attack it as a political matter. :banghead:

For me it most definitely is a political matter, as well as a criminal one. Key members of his political party who had the power to do something about it chose to keep silent. I think anyone who knew should be charged with aiding and abetting, and be removed from office. I don't care what party they belong to. However if his crimes were known to multiple powerful members of one party and their silence allowed him to continue, ie. they allowed him access to pages, then I wonder if the crime is conspiracy as opposed to a&a.

I think this guy was sick with power.....I'm glad he got caught

Lilith,

Why is that?

To me, that makes it a system issue and not a political one.

Aside from the subject of this individual scumbag, my concern is that I have never seen "divide et impera" so well employed in the United States as the gangsters in power today have done. I believe that only when citizens get their heads out of their ………. Left, Right, Conservative, Liberal……. arm pits and demand a government free of incompetence, cronyism and corruption, will we be a nations again worthy of expounding the lofty ideals we carve in marble, teach to the unprivileged, then cover with shit. :box:

But I guess that would be another thread, wouldn't it? :D

PantyFanatic,

I wish I knew of one.

It's all those things you mention that make it a political matter. It is the very nature of the political structure (one party in power in at least 2 of 3 branches) as it has become today that allows for these things to occur.

If a teacher at my school was inappropriate with a student and she knew and kept silent allowing that teacher access to more children, you can bet your sweet ass she'd be in a world of hurt. She is accountable to a community which would not permit her turning a blind eye. The difference in this case is who Foley/Hastert had to answer to.

Should we not expect as much from our elected officials as we do from people who have to earn their positions? Throw the bums out!

I don't recall mentioning any things.

Are you suggesting that because one party is in power in 2 of three branches that these things happen? Unless I am mistaken (and alas that is all too possible) if there exist 3 branches of government (the Executive, the Legeslature, and the Judiciary), and there exists two political parties (the Democtrats and the Republicans), then at any time one or the other of the parties must control/be in power in two or more of the branches of government.

I do like that idea.

That was my point. I have this archaic idea that they were suppose to be answering to THE PEOPLE! Our government isn't a football game where anything you can get away with is OK as long as the coach approves.

PantyFanatic,

What are elections?

I'll assume PF talking about a govermant of the people for the people by the people.

Elected by those who care enough to vote?

So are you saying if some one chose not to vote they are less the some one who dose?

Booger,

It is very difficult, if not impossible, for a democratic government to represent the views of people who do not express their opinions by voting.

A government which is elected by people is of that people. What do you call rulers who are NOT elected?

With this line of reasoning the people who vote for anyone who dosen't win are in the same boat as those who don't vote. So dose that also make them less important then the ones who voted for the winner?

Boog, stop putting quotes in your posts. I can't put them on ignore.

Boog,

In a perfect world an elected official acts for the electorate for which he was chosen as the preferred representative. The concept of political parties skews this altruism, and "voting at the Party call" removes the illusion of democracy totally.

Sadly, If you voted agin them, they're usually agin you.

All I can say is I'm glad he's "out" now!

Booger,

I think you are mistaken. Those who ignore reality do not work towards a resolution of important issues. Those who vote try.

Partisan politics is a natural outgrowth of a healthy democracy. An informed and active electorate – those who vote – is essential for democracies. What do you offer as an alternative?

LixyChick,

Yes'm. In more ways than one. :D

Now what state was Foley from?? The trouble is it is not a political problem, but one of sociaty. If we had news organizations that reported an unbiased news and people listened to the truth and voted accordingly then the problem would not be so wide spread. But when the "people" do not care, the politications will do as they please and it does not matter what party they belong to, Greed is Greed.

speaking of news orgs, i was surprised by the number of people who responded to the blotter article just to smack ross for "making up news and making news out of nothing." hind sight's twenty twenty but still, jeesh. they bitch when ya do and they bitch when ya don't...




yup yup. and furthermore, that sort of communally responsible mentality is becoming prevalent in more and more of today's criminal laws-- besides the usual aid and abet stuff--bar tenders held accountable for serving a visibly inebriated patron, failing to report known illegals, parents found criminally liable for the crimes, even just truancy, that their children commit.

it’s a twisted irony alright. these are the women and men who write and pass the bills that urge, if not force, the genpop to take a more proactive role in their communities against crime when usually they can’t be bothered to give a flying fluck about what the other people in their community have been up to until it’s election time.

I'm increasingly more discouraged each and every time I go to the polls. It's become a matter of "which candidate will harm me the least" instead of "who best represents my ideals". I can see why people stop voting.

The system is such now that people that would probably do a very good job of saying what's on most people's minds, have too many obstacles to clear. Meanwhile, assholes like Foley are not only elected...but apparently allowed to run rampent despite having been discovered by others that consciously decided to cover up a potential "stain" on the party name instead of running the risk of being applauded for taking the moral high ground and shining the spotlight on this prick.

I'm sick of nobody doing what's right.

Regardless of Foley's political affiliation, what I believe Lil is trying to say is that those who are also of Foley's political affiliation were aware of his issues and choose to either ignore, coverup by warning pages of his potential interests, or do nothing about what he was/is doing for the main reason that the discovery of his actions would not only bring him down, but those affiliated with the same party he is. Those who kept quiet only kept quiet because they wanted to protect their image of being the majority or in 'power' politically. They weren't worried about what he did/does to children!

I agree with Lil on this - if they knew (and articles state that some knew as far back as five years ago), they should have turned him in. Instead they ignored it! That makes them just as guilty as the predator in my book.

Gentlefolk,

I must admit that I have a more difficult time getting worked up about this than some do. Scandalous behavior has been a repeating feature among the powerful since the time of the Roman emperors – and was probably old before that. There is even a couple of guided Washington DC tours of the better good old American scandals.

Why expect these people to be any different than those they represent? Just uncover the behavior, put ‘em on trial, convict and imprison them – just as would happen to those they represent.

Lilith had the right idea: Throw the bums out! I do like the notion that the good Mr. Foley may be prosecuted under legislation he was instrumental in forging. :D

"Why expect these people to be any different than those they represent?"

They represent themselves to be pinnacles of the community.

"Just uncover the behavior, put ‘em on trial, convict and imprison them "

Easily said until tried. These people call for a burdon of proof way over the common man in order to defend these people from unfounded politically motivated actions.

Bingo!^^^^^ Especially prudent when some judges are appointed by politicians.

If I can't buy beer in public because it threatens my reputation in the community, I'll be damned if someone representing the entire fucking district they are from in Florida should not be held to the same level.

Scandalous behavior that involves taking advantage and harming children is very easy for me to get worked up about.

We have a bizarre custom here in Oz that says that if it's legal, anyone who doesn't like it can either work to change the law or lump it.

You can have freedom without anarchy or oppressive double standards.

Gentlefolk,

Far be it for me to say what should or should not get your knickers in a twist! If you prefer getting upset at humans behaving as humans have done throughout history, as they obviously do now, and will continue to behave (barring some unexpected ethical mutation) until the sun goes into the scheduled Red Giant phase, by all means, do your thing.

I do think that, as you seem to expect behavior from humans which cannot - in any way, shape, or form - be predicted from the culture which created them, you will be repeatedly disappointed. Why set your expectations so high? They will only be dashed repeatedly. What possible good does it do to believe for the N+1 time that this one or that one is above all that, particularly as there are sooooooooooooooo many examples – scattered throughout time and all across the planet - to suggest that the probability of it being true is so low?

Accept that these people are as we are – with all the failings and foibles we have – for they are of us. For those who want to know why these people are as venal, base and low – in addition (if we are to be honest) to being as ethical, principled and inspiring – we need look for examples no farther away than our friends and neighbors. For the brave – hold up a mirror.

I am repeatedly disappointed jseal. I am disappointed every time I read about adults harming innocent children. However, because I am disappointed, in my own little corner of the world - I can be there for a child - whether I am able to prevent something hideous from happening to them, or by being there for them after something hideous happens. Because if I can prevent something from happening, that is one less child I will read about in the papers. If I can be there for that child that has gone through something that makes me shudder and become dissapointed, help that child get through it and not become another carbon copy of his/her abuser, then my dissapointment in our culture will never be a wasted emotion because I should expect these things to happen and to continue to happen.

I will never accept that THESE people are as I am - failings and foibles in all. :( because I am not as they are.

Expect nothing better and never be disappointed. Great plan.