Woops, missed one. My brother used the phrases he did because young women can be exceedingly stupid, and have been known to fall for the line. Wether that means they have half a brain or not, I'm not entirely sure. But he wanted to make sure his point was made.

G

No apologies need, G. I've been misunderstood and misinterpreted all my life, I don't expect the world - male or female - to suddenly change to fit little Jaybee's need for concision, precision and relevance and logic.

On that note, if I'm being utterly honest, this is not the first time I've been taken out of context for my views by and about women. There, I've confessed. But I'm intrigued...what was it about my first post that made you feel like the women who wanted that guy fired were in need of defence?

By the way, you were right to circle the wagons...I'm actually an Indian...




J

*laughing* Must be the good Wisconsin farm stock in me....either that or the 1/4 Glaswegian scrapper.



Hmmm....totally fair question. I think I felt there was an implication that any problem women had with men expressing their sexuality at work was "in our heads" so to speak. The idea that girls are just making a fuss about nothing. I do think there is a real reason why they might object, and that any objections raised wouldn't necessarily be for the reasons you described. All too often real cases of sexual harrassment (NOT what you were setting out, but it's around the same trigger) are dismissed as women who can't take a joke. I wanted to try to explain that they may HAVE a point, just not the one you were suggesting. And I think I felt the way you presented it was dismissive of ANY objections.

Does that make more sense?

G

Doesn't sex mean more if people have it when they both want it? Are you saying that women want more sex than they have, but are afraid to go out and get it because they don't understand how much men want it? Mrs. WI knows damn well how much I want it...that doesn't seem to help.

If cavemen and cavewomen had equivalent bodypower, perhaps starting off on a level playing field would've made us a lot more respectful of each other.

__________________
Though I am different from you,
We were born involved in one another.

For it was not into my ear you whispered, but into my heart. It was not my lips you kissed, but my soul.

Complete surrender should not just come at moments in which one faces overwhelming odds, but in the calm when it seems one is personally in complete control of one's life.

OK...not that anyone wants to see my name on this thread any more...but I just saw the title and had a random thought that made me giggle.

If all women became men for a month....anti-sodomy laws would be repealed within a week.

Going now....no need to throw things .

G

It does indeed. My hypothetical scenario too closely resembled that of a sexual harrassment case for comfort, and it came across as though I were actually encouraging the hypothetical post-boys unashamedness. A few of the other ladies also mistook it as such, so perhaps I should have been more emphatic.

But now the example is clarified, let's go back to it; If western society developed, in a few decades, to the stage where rape, or derision for expressing/acting on sexual desire, was never a possibility - as unrealistically utopian as that first appears - would the women who lived in a society and worked in that office NOT joyously/sympathetically applaud that postboys display of enthusiasm?

What I'm saying here is that one of the most grievous shortcomings of our so-called 'advanced' society is that the sexes are at an impasse which seems to be deadlocked. Women can't put out as much as they themselves would like for fear of being labelled 'sluts' or worse, for fear of being raped by a would-be date. Men, for their part, tread on eggshells trying to appear as unthreatening, cultivated and as decent as possible. Noble aims in and of themselves, but we shouldn't NEED to do it to reassure. But we men do need to reassure, however. Because of the strength differential. Women don't rape men, as a rule. Sorry if I seem to be hitting you all over the head with the same blunt points, but I want to make sure they're sinking in. Sex may no longer be a taboo subject of conversation, but it is still a heavily restricted, constrained activity.

So, we have two genders who both want more sex. One would LOVE to give more, the other would love to be given more. The people here at Pixies are very much proof of that. This is why, in a generation or so with monitoring technology recording every ray of light and every sound made by ants farting, and biotech having eradicated VD/Aids etc, my (future) son ought to feel perfectly entitled to stroll up to an unfamiliar girl at a barbecue whose smile he finds irrestistible, casually but politely ask, "Would you like to have sex?", feeling no more sheepish than if he were asking her for a light, and not get a slap/white wine on his face. And she should feel perfectly free to accept his request and do it right there and then, with no more shame than if she were sluttishly and disgracefully whipping out her Zippo and publicly lighting his Marlboro in front of all those strangers!!

But neither side can break this deadlock. We men and women are stuck dancing this ridiculous dance with each other. Ironic that, as a species, we are the only one that uses contraception, so we should be screwing like crazy, yet our females STILL fear involuntary insemination. I look forward to a day when NOBODY is going without, for any reason. I look forward to the day when one of the gals in that office pulls that poor boy into broom cupboard with no more hesitance than if she were buying him a beer in O'Malleys.

Anyway...as the popular phrase round here goes, "Rant over". I've talked enough.

Now, if you'll excuse me, I need to get off. I suggest you all do the same...




J.

and there would be a new way to do/get the information provided by a pap smear and a mammogram

__________________

The practice of putting women on pedestals began to die out when it was discovered that they could give orders better from there.~ Betty Grable

If I wanted your opinion, I'd remove the duct tape and ask you for it.~ Me
<~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~>
One man's dream is another man's nightmare~~~~> §¤ Lilith ¤§
~>My Scribbles<~
==>Gone Shopping<== ~Just a Quickie~ *~A Celebration Vacation~* ~Surprises~ Sleeping With the Window Open
What Did You Do Today? Self Defense Class ~Short Sweet Snippets~ § Summer Spin § Story Challenge Submission Pajamas

Jaybee - fear is a human universal...of course its healthy to fear certain things and people. Some people call that self preservation!

I agree with you it sucks that male sexuality is often forced into repression. But as many other pixies have mentioned, female sexuality is equally, and in some cases more repressed in our Western society. Trust me, men would learn a lot about the needs and constraints of female sexuality if they became women for a month. Or hell, even a week or a day!

Also - caveman does not have to overpower cavewoman for the sake of population expansion. I think its engrained in the both the male and the female mind to procreate. I'm sure most fathers did not have to use brute force to tackle the mother into procreating! Well, unless they were really kinky. And don't forget that, in MANY other species, the female is usually larger than the male!

jaybee -

I have found something on which we agree! Yes, I DO want more sex......definitely! LOADS of it! I want sex at least three times a day!

But I only want it with my chosen partner. And if I wasn't with him, despite still being desperate for sex three times a day, I STILL wouldn't be taking the opportunity to shag the enthusiastic post boy, or even be appreciative of his erection. Why? Because I'm not in the slightest bit attracted to him. Why? Because he's a stranger. I don't fancy people until I've got to know them. I'm not interested in a random sex act with a stranger, I have no desire to get physically close to a man I don't know.

And I'm not scared of accidental insemination......that's why there are contraceptives. And I'm not frigid (I've been masturbating to orgasm since the age of 8, for Christ's sake). And I'm not scared of being raped (I can honestly say that weeks, maybe months go by at a time, when the thought doesn't even cross my mind) I'm just not turned on by the sight of someone I'm not attracted to having an erection. In general it's just not the way that women are wired.....and I'm afraid that's all there is to it.

I wonder if I am alone in this respect, or whether women would agree with me here. My main reason for not having sex with random people (the way you think it should happen for your future son - by the way, have you read 'Brave New World'?) is because I have never found myself in a situation where I've wanted to. To confirm, I've only ever had one one night stand and that was with a friend I'd had for 2 years, the shortest amount of time I've ever spent getting to know someone before so much as kissing them is about 3 weeks. I guess I'm just not that easy to arouse - if anything because it takes my body some convincing that the pleasure it might gain from a sexual encounter with a particular man, is going to be better than the pleasure I can give myself. And my instincts have usually been right! LOL

__________________
"Time flies like an arrow -
Fruit flies like a banana"

M Y - N A U G H T Y - P I C T U R E S ! !

I'm in agreement Lou....

I'm not interested cause you've done nothing to interest me. Where as there are men on this board, I'd shag in a heartbeat, sight unseen because they have stimulated me in ways that count.

__________________

The practice of putting women on pedestals began to die out when it was discovered that they could give orders better from there.~ Betty Grable

If I wanted your opinion, I'd remove the duct tape and ask you for it.~ Me
<~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~>
One man's dream is another man's nightmare~~~~> §¤ Lilith ¤§
~>My Scribbles<~
==>Gone Shopping<== ~Just a Quickie~ *~A Celebration Vacation~* ~Surprises~ Sleeping With the Window Open
What Did You Do Today? Self Defense Class ~Short Sweet Snippets~ § Summer Spin § Story Challenge Submission Pajamas

__________________

I'll second the above two motions as well, because their inverses are also true, very definitely. But as for Lou...

Here is truly where men and womens brains are differently structured. I like the thought of being able to go up to a girl I like, one who I may only have spoken to for a few minutes, and asking for sex as if I were asking her for a light. Men want to spread their seed, while most women want something from a guy before sleeping with him.

But nobody can tell me that Miss Millionairess doesn't have a different gigolo in her bedroom every few weeks, if not more often. No? Bullshit. If I were a fabulously rich young post-settlement heiress, I'd be screwing a different Chippendale every week, because I know I can afford to do so, and if Mr Chip tries anything nasty, my 2 waiting bodyguards will tear him a new one. And if THEY are in cahoots with Chip, my 2nd level of trusty security will, upon sighting the transgression via the hidden ceiling cams, storm the bedchambers and rip all the men already inside to bits.

Most women don't have the resources needed for the above. Neither do most men, and to make matters worse, neither side is doing much to mitigate the situation. But if you ADD the resources necessary, within a not so long period of time people WILL fuck normally. My entire point is that sex is a simple, biological function like eating, drinking or breathing, so why the FUCK do we still attach so much stigma to it?

It'll happen, trust me. The shame of it is I'll probably be an old coot by the time it does, and no doubt I'll cry with overdue joy at the dawn of this beautiful new world, but it WILL happen. Having sex with an attractive stranger in a bar a few minutes of meeting will be no more a big deal than buying him a beer in the same bar. Sex in public will be contentious for a while, but will one day be as acceptable as using toothpicks after eating in a steakhouse.

Gotta say, I'm quite surprised by the comparatively victorian approaches of some of you Pixie ladies. I expected better, but the day WILL come when the 2020/2030's version of 'Sex In The City', as a reflection of (then) current life, features 3 'Samantha' type characters, and only one 'Charlotte' type (although that woman is a scorcher...it must be the glasses that do it for me!!)




Jaybee.

Dude...you just set men back a hundred years. You're a stray dog trying to hump every poodle that can't outrun you.

I don't wanna spread my seed. I wanna have sex with someone I love.

__________________
Though I am different from you,
We were born involved in one another.

For it was not into my ear you whispered, but into my heart. It was not my lips you kissed, but my soul.

Complete surrender should not just come at moments in which one faces overwhelming odds, but in the calm when it seems one is personally in complete control of one's life.

Whoa, hold the fucking phone.

While I understand your underlying point, although I don't agree with it, I am, in fact, offended by the canine reference. By calling me a 'dog', not only are you insulting me, but you then drag class into this mess by calling me a stray one. And by extension, you're calling my mother a bitch - and buster, I'm just glad you didn't do that to my face.

I'm sure we can be pals at a later point when all concerned have cooled off but for now, I'll only tell you once...back off.


Jaybee.

OMG - I can't believe I'm reading this!

I just love the idea that women are only discerning in their choice of sexual partners because they're worried they're going to come to physical harm if they get involved with 'strange men'. I can certainly tell you this is not the case for me, since the man I'm engaged to marry I met on a sex site on the internet (it's called Pixies, btw) and went up to his home town to meet him. On our first day of meeting, he ended up in my hotel room, having ordered breakfast for two, before I'd even made my mind up whether or not to kiss him! It's really not my personal safety that governs my decisions about men. It's whether I find them attractive, as I've already stated.

And as I've also already stated, whether I find a guy physically attractive or not, has nothing to do with what they look like. I can but my hand on my heart and say that, personally, I have never been in a situation where I've seen an 'attractive stranger' in a bar, and even wanted to approach them for a drink. The reason? Someone isn't attractive to me until I know them. I think physically, Johnny Depp is one of the most good looking men on the planet, but if I bumped into him in a night club, I wouldn't want to have sex with him. This is not about stigma, it's about feeling the need for such physical intimacy with a person. There are some things that you just wouldn't want to do with another person, unless you felt something for them (whether that something is love/ attraction/ whatever). If physical interaction is so casual a thing, would you be willing to stick your finger inside a man's anus? No? Why not? Oh, because you don't fancy men......well, guess what I don't fancy strangers. It's the same thing. It's not about being uptight or 'Victorian' it's about not being wet!!!!

I'm curious to know whether you've ever been in love, or even cared deeply for a woman you've had sex with, because I'm pretty sure your views on this would be different if you had been. Once you've experienced how much better sex is when you have an emotional connection with your partner, the idea that sex is just a biological function is really presposterous.

As for sex in public, as long as children are allowed out of the house, sex in publc is NOT something that's going to become the norm. Or do you think it's healthy for young children to be exposed to sex in this manner (bearing in mind that showing children pornography is considered child abuse in this country because of it's psychologically damaging effect)?

Also, with this 'Brave New World' in which we are promiscuous and children are either kept away from public or else encouraged to be involved in 'sexual play' (OMG, is this sounding like an Aldous Huxley book to anyone else?) what of HIV and AIDS? Are you seriously telling me that people will be happy to have sex indiscriminately, regardless of whether their partners may be infectious? Even WITH condoms? Because I sure as fuck wouldn't take the risk of sleeping with someone if I knew they had HIV - condoms aren't infallible.

To return to the original point, there are women out there who you can just approach for sex, and they'll go fuck you, no questions asked. They completely understand how men 'NEED' sex. That's why they charge men for it.

On a final note, Victorian attitudes. I genuinely feel that no-one on this thread has expressed any Victorian attitudes - except one. And that one, is you. Your attitude towards women is the most Victorian thing I've encountered in a long time. If you honestly think that women 'want something from a guy before sleeping with him' and that it's a case of us wanting to have sex but cowering in fear of you big strong men then you really do need to think carefully about why it is that women are not 'giving it up' enough in your opinion. Could it be that this thread is about why women are not 'giving it up for you'? In which case I could hazard a guess that it's not about fear, or prudishness or societal pressures, it's that women like to have sex with men who are respectful of our gender. Who appreciate the differences between men and women, and who realise that we're wonderful just as we are. You can make all the excuses you like about why you aren't getting enough sex from enough women, but perhaps, just perhaps you shouldn't be looking at what's wrong with us women but what's wrong with you.

Lou
x

P.S. Interestingly, I had a conversation with a group of friends last night (both male and female) and I was the only person there who thought that 'cunt' was a word you could use to describe the female gentials during sex. I only mention it so that you realise that when extolling the virtues of sex as an expression of love/ attraction, I'm not referring to 'love making' in the traditional, roses, candles and moonlight kind of way.

Finally, I've just seen your reply to WildIrish. It's good to see you have strong feelings for your mother....I wonder how you'd feel if you found out she was well known in her neighbourhood as being a really great fuck. Maybe your friends have all had a go and found she gives the best head around and doesn't mind the odd spot of anal either! If we're going to liberate women sexually, we going to be liberating ALL women, including your mother, grandmother, aunts wife, daughters etc......and it'll be them you're watching in the street when sex in public is de rigeur - won't that be fun?!

__________________
"Time flies like an arrow -
Fruit flies like a banana"

M Y - N A U G H T Y - P I C T U R E S ! !